A website that aggressively publishes positions disagreeing with the Seventh-day Adventist Church on women’s ordination and LGBT issues, reports that North American Division (NAD) president Dan Jackson presented a proposal to General Conference (GC) leadership with laughably minimalist disciplinary steps for non-compliant unions. The NAD is said to be proposing three sanctions.
First, that persons from Columbia and Pacific Unions who serve on the General Conference executive committee continue with voice and vote but not be permitted to serve in GC subcommittee leadership roles (as if GC leadership would place these men in such positions at present). Second, that ordinations of women in those Unions not be recognized outside those Unions (a non-starter since those rebel ordinations are already NOT accepted outside those Unions). And third, that General Conference auditing services check these Unions for compliance with the world churches voted policy regarding women’s ordination.
In other words, if the report is accurate, the NAD is proposing to do nothing about the present disregard for the instruction of God in His Word as well as the voice of the Church at three General Conference sessions. This is actually a proposal to give more time to the deviant Unions to strengthen their “cause.”
The proposed sanctions leave the current practice of ordaining women operative in those places, leaves insubordinate leaders in positions where they can continue to promote disunity, and they institutionalize congregationalism by permitting Unions to continue to act independently of the world church.
Such inaction, posing as discipline, would leave the church even more fragmented. The plan Jackson is said to have set forth prepares the way for disregard of the Bible in other areas including LGBT (lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender) issues, and threatens to reduce the Seventh-day Adventist Church to a patchwork of regional churches offering conflicting teachings.
The proposed sanctions, even if enacted, would leave the majority of NAD membership which broadly supports the world church and opposes women’s ordination, disenfranchised and doubtful. Many NAD members feel the Division has been hijacked and would see only betrayal in General Conference acceptance of such proposals.
Will Spring Meeting tell the NAD its proposal is unacceptable? How long will the NAD continue in open defiance of the world church and open promotion of disunity?
We rest in God’s promise that the “gates of hell” will not prevail against the Church that is built on Jesus the Rock, who taught us to obey God’s Word.
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28 replies on “NAD Spring WO Proposal Fail”
While I don’t agree with the first two sanctions for the reasons expressed by the article, I do not understand what the third proposal accomplishes. Continued call to prayer that the GC leadership who should rightly enforce the vote of the General Conference in session will have discernment and the courage to follow through in action and deed.
Cathy, what is going on can be called the Balaam syndrome where one keeps going back to God, like Balaam did, until God agreed with him. So it is in the church today. Some use calls to prayer to cover their true hearts desire to get around a plain “thus says the Lord.” To call for prayer when the Lord’s will has been revealed in His Word and the Spirit of Prophecy is simply outright rebellion wrapped in a prayer robe to cover one’s true character.
-Doug Carlson
Yes, I agree; I just can’t figure out the rational (even though it is faulty for the reason you expressed) of the third sanction in their proposal. Someone may see it and explain it. 🙂
amen!
” How long will the NAD continue in open defiance of the world church and open promotion of disunity?”
Just as long as the GC does not act to discipline but only threaten the NAD.
“We rest in God’s promise that the “gates of hell” will not prevail against the Church that is built on the rock of obedience to God’s Word.”
And in this we can be sure, but only if the condition of “obedience to God’s Word” is the dynamic of the promise and not some “unconditional election” that some at least seem to envision. EGW never endorsed this false doctrine but warned in this exhortation.
“In the balances of the sanctuary the Seventh-day Adventist church is to be weighed. She will be judged by the privileges and advantages that she has had. If her spiritual experience does not correspond to the advantages that Christ, at infinite cost, has bestowed on her, if the blessings conferred have not qualified her to do the work entrusted to her, on her will be pronounced the sentence: “Found wanting.” By the light bestowed, the opportunities given, will she be judged.” 8T 247
Here are the conditions stated and results if the conditions are abandon or ignored.
Amen! Bill,
It’s time for the Brethren, to make the decision, to release Daniel Jackson President of the North American Division, with whatever, means that are available, to the General Conference.
Daniel Jackson is deliberately “Apostatizing, without any regard, whatsoever, to the rift that he’s causing within the Adventist church! I believe releasing Daniel Jackson. Will reduce 85% of the problem, if not all,of it!
This has got to stop, Satan will not, and the church must utilize the power given to it, having “faith” in what is written; in Luke 10:19
Jackson is the icon representative of the whole liberal agenda in the SDA church. Getting Jackson out would be a good start, but I doubt it would really stop the apostasy as so many embrace his spirituality. But it would cause some church members to realize the seriousness of the situation. Many still consider it a trivial matter to small to take seriously.
But now that the Gay agenda is making real progress in the church, that may also be a factor to wake up at least some church members and maybe even a few pastors.
People like their “comfort zone” and don’t really like to be disturbed. And this is one major reason the liberal movement has made strong inroads into the church, but also why they maintain such a strong hold on the church. The present call for unity is not the answer or solution to the real spiritual problem. The church has abandon the bible and EGW but would never admit it or say so. Only when enough members realize this situation and the seriousness of it, can we expect any real dynamic action.
God will eventually “force” a situation that demands a decision and most are not ready to know or make the right choice. They have been “bottle fed” their religion and do not really know their bibles and confusion will be the result for many. So we work and wait and pray as we know the God ordained message of truth is still inherent in the basic message that created the SDA church. But many are changing the message and people don’t even know it. We know it is a basic false application of the gospel. But not too many seem to see this fact.
Though we are loath to hear it expressed, heresy in the church is what brings about a separation in the shaking and sifting. With so much that is beyond our control, we can individually choose where our allegiance will be. We need to individually come before the Judge of the Earth and then intercede for our church.There’s plenty of blame to go around. I want to be standing as Daniel, who included himself in the church when he prayed the beautiful prayer of repentance in Daniel 9.
Bill Sorensen asked a good question on 4-9-17. He asked:
“How long will the NAD continue in open defiance of the world church and open promotion of disunity?”
ANSWER
As long as the money comes in from those who are pushing that agenda.
As long as wealthy women use their wealth to push the feminist agenda, those men who want to be politically correct will continue to feast at Jezebel’s table and tell the ladies what they want to hear.
However, when the judge of the Universe enters the discussion, they will weep and howl over the results of their infidelity.
Maranatha 🙂
Ray
And here is the deal with Dan Jackson. He is leading a “Korah rebellion” against properly ordained authority. If and when they remove him and his immediate followers, the rest of the rabble will say as in the Korah rebellion against Moses, “You have killed the people of the Lord”.
I’ve seen this rebellion coming for decades and it developed right after the Dr. Ford fiasco. He was the original “Korah” who attack EGW decades ago. But the church allowed the spirit of that rebellion to grow to the level it is today. Dan Jackson is just the ongoing spirit of evil the church allowed for decades. Remember the words of Solomon.
“The curse causeless shall not come.”
But the real problem is deeper than this. The SDA church has never had a clear law and gospel definition and application. While Jones and Waggoner stimulated a discussion on the gospel in its relationship to the law, neither Jones or Waggoner were mature bible theologians and scholars. They bungled there way along until both left the truth of the SDA movement. And now we have an “1888 cult” spirituality that is anything but a true bible message. And so we have two sides in opposition to each other and “both are partly in the right, but still completely in the wrong.”
As Danny Bell stated, we are in for a vicious split and few will stand solely on bible truth. What this means, like the civil government that will unite democrats and republicans, the religious element will unite the false liberal and false conservatives all in one big false movement for the conversion of the world.
There is worse than a “vicious split”.
A split is coming…its going to be huge…..
Primary question: How does one think it logical to propose one’s own sanctions? No country under consideration for sanctions by the U.S. would ever think to try that! What child tells his mother how to punish him for correction? I find no logic in such an attempt. It would be humorous if it were not so sad.
You are correct. I am trying to give the benefit of the doubt as an onlooker. I trust the leaders who are dealing with this will have wisdom, mercy, kindness, and courage in all the right measure. I believe they will. We are praying. There is a day of fasting and prayer for the world church planned on the first Sabbath of July. I think this is the time for such deliberation. See revivalandreformation.org
I put this in the next article by mistake. So I re-copied it here.
“Everyone should read the comment by David Read on Fulcrum 7 in this article. It is time to take the lid off and quit all this “make believe” all will be OK. It won’t. God will create a community of true believers by the bible. Whether the SDA church is instrumental in the final development is not relevant or even known for sure. God raised up the SDA movement and it has been beneficial to a certain level like the Jews of the Old Testament. Whether it will continue in the role is dependent on the responses of both leaders and lay members. And that remains to be seen.
“Make it Loud, and Make it Proud! Analyzing Chris Oberg’s Sermon”
This article is on Fulcrum 7 and reveals the depth of evil the church has allowed. You will never read anything like this in the Review. As Herbert W. Bush said, “It wouldn’t be prudent.”
Well, all of this, looks like confusion have set in, and the real, reality, of what the Seventh-Day Adventist Church is faced with, in these last days; are the issues and problems; that have found its way into the church, and the Brethren, wondering, as if, what to do with the person, and the people that are causing these new set of problems!
We know who they are! …and as Bill Sorensen pointed out, and I as well …and I do agree!!! Daniel Jackson, President of the North American Division, is the Icon, and the perpetrator, behind these issues that is plaguing the church; and he has been relentless!
I have been reading, how some are saying we need to pray for him, and the others that he has mesmerized.
Not withstanding, the Brethren, have been very, very patient, with Daniel Jackson.
It is obvious that Satan has infiltrated, the Remnant church, and the current Leadership, is caught up with what is the right thing to do! However, as a “Watchman” I Encourage the Leadership to Read Your Bible, and Be Encourage! …and it’s time to follow the word of “GOD” as it is written:
Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother. But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established. ….and if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.
Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven. Matthew 18: 15-18
My dear Brethren, Satan is not playing games, for he knows that the Second Coming of “JESUS CHRIST is upon us; and Surely; “JESUS” is Coming Again!
In the meantime, Satan has unleashed Demons in the Remnant Church, but I’m of the “Faith” and a firm believer in what is written in the word of “GOD” that the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it! Mathew 16:18
Who would have ever thought, the Spirits of “HOMOSEXUALITY” would have entered in the church, demanding its own space? ….and the church, Compromising the word of “GOD” to accommodate this spirit? ….and the Church worshipping under Satan’s “Fake” lamb like Spirit, in a camouflage, and perpetrating a fake spirit of “Unconditional Love”.
These are sure signs, that the “Holy Spirit” is slowly being withdrawn, from the earth, readying for the Second Coming of ” JESUS CHRIST”!
Once again, it looks like the Spirit of Prophecy comes through again, that the “Laymen” are going to have to be the ones to finish the work!
Even So… Come Lord “JESUS”
It is the spirituality of this WO movement that also embraces the Gay agenda. Many will try to deny it, but the basis of the WO movement is exactly the doctrine of the Gay agenda as well.
And whether people will admit it or not, it is the same spirituality that changed the Sabbath from the 7th day to Sunday the first day. The devil is too clever to attack the Sabbath up front in the SDA church. He must first infuse a false spirituality and then move step by step bringing in more and more liberal ideas until the members see no need to support the Sabbath against Sunday keepers. All you have to do is read articles and comments on the liberal forums like Atoday and Spectrum to witness the final outcome.
Some still claim to support the Sabbath and some do not. But the final outcome is obvious and certain to anyone who understands the false spirituality of the liberal agenda. It is a lawless antichrist movement in the SDA church and now has a strong strangle hold of the church in general. And our leaders simply continue to patronize this false movement inspired by Satan. But, as Paul said, “We will by all means save some.”
And now we know why EGW stated that the majority will abandon the truth for delusions and false doctrine. As Danny Bell has stated, the split is becoming more and more obvious and intense. How long before it blows up, we don’t know. But it will surely come and “everything that can be shaken, will be shaken.” We need to fortify our minds more and more on bible truth and be ready for it.
Wow! ….and Bill, I guess there’s no other way to put it!
Satan, has effectively gotten into the Seventh-Day Adventist Church, Big Time! …and it looks like, he’s going to not only split it, but try and break it up… all of it!
The rest of us better pray, maintaining our “Faith” in “JESUS CHRIST” and believing in “HIS” word, that the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it! Amen! Even So…. Come Lord “JESUS “!
Ellen White wrote about the Church looking like it was about to fall and that promo ate people would be shaken out but the Church would go through to the end. I agree with Doug Carlson. This definitely is the Balaam syndrome. Revelation also condemns Balaam for his advice to King Balak to entice the Children of Israel into sexual sins.
Let’s read the extra reading for the SS Bible study this very week: “Scriptures as a Safeguard” and the other recommended chapters in the GC. This is our part of our preparation for whatever is ahead.
I was born and raised Adventist and as an adult. Why? Because SDA church leaders are hypocrites! They are willing to believe a woman can be a true prophet and can recieve revelation directly from God, but cant function as a pastor? Additionally, they believe female inspired doctrine and subsequent writings can be revered as truth and allowed to dictate fundamental church beliefs, but they can’t dictate local congregational policy? The truth is, logically you can’t believe in one without believing in the other, and since you continue to allow your church to be guided by Ellen White, your argument against female ordination is flawed. SDA leadership, with your own beliefs you have condemned youselves. Therefore, its time to stop hiding behind your erraneous interpretation scripture and face the facts: One, God can speak through anyone and anything. Two, God cares not about gender dimorphism or physical atributes and only sees the heart. Three, In the last days God will pour out His spirit on all flesh- which includes women. And Four, the sad truth is that your continued denial of female ordination and leadership is simply a result of your patriarchal egotism combined with your worldly desire for women to be subordinate to your sinful will and flesh.
Thank you for sharing your testimony, Jennifer. I will admit that as the True Witness testifies in Rev. 314-22, I am a member of the church that is represented as Laodicea. We do not see ourselves as we really are. But if we come to God, He will give us discernment through His Holy Spirit. He will also give us Christ’s righteousness. That is what we need. I agree with you that God can speak through anyone. The teaching that God designed men to lead out in the church doesn’t exclude that. Secondly, God did say that while we are caught up with outward appearances, He looks on the motives of the heart. (I Sam. 16:7) But it is also God who created humans male and female. Their looks are different and their inner workings are unique. He has specific ways to use their special gifts. God designed an order in His creation. After sin, He gave specific instruction about the order of the family. It is not the figment of some patriarch’s imagination. (Gen. 3:16) The order of the church follows the model of the family. In fact, one of the qualifications of a bishop is that he rule his own house (I Tim. 3:4). Jennifer, this has not always been done in a godly way. For our sins, we must repent. But the plan is God’s. If we are willing, He will empower us with His Holy Spirit to accomplish His will.
” They are willing to believe a woman can be a true prophet and can recieve revelation directly from God, but cant function as a pastor? ”
Jennifer, many don’t seem to be able to distinguish between the role of a prophet who is picked by God and not by the church, vs. the role of a pastor who is evaluated by the church to determine their qualification for that role.
The church never determines who can be a prophet and who can not. A prophet of God is a prophet whether the church acknowledges it or not. Historically, the true prophet of God was rejected by “the church” but this did not negate the fact they were a prophet.
The final point is, you can’t compare the role of a prophet with a pastor on every level. Hopefully, both serve the Lord but are not on the same level of church leadership. The fact EGW was a woman prophet can in no way be interpreted to assume this means the church can choose a woman to be a pastor. God chooses a prophet. The church chooses the pastors and they have different roles.
Affirmative.
Is there NO WAY for the General Conference to facilitate a representative vote by the NAD constituency or delegates on this matter and make that coincide with the possible new nomination or elections of leaders? To me the real question is does the current leadership of the NAD represent the NAD constituency? Can we ascertain this first? It it does emanate that the NAD constituency share the positions of their leaders to reject the decision of the world church in San Antonio, then we are duty bound to respect that AND allow all the churches that take this position to seceed and form another organization. It will be a far better situation to deal with separation than contamination and paralysis.
The Adventist form of church government is representative. Members need to become sufficiently organized among themselves to act to replace false leaders (those who act in opposition to the will of our Lord Jesus). A few no doubt will be replaced for insubordination from the top, but many will need to be replaced at the constituency level. It is time for this. Members who are dissatisfied should roll up their sleeves and get to work in this line, and stop waiting for God to swoop in and do it directly for us.
“…stop waiting for God to swoop in and do it directly for us.”
This is consistent with the counsel of the prophet (EGW). God will not do for us that which He has left for us to do. If He DOES have to act because His people fail to, woe, woe, woe unto the house of Israel.
I think we need a website where members can view the votes of their elected leaders in their conferences, unions, and divisions. And also the votes of our elected member representatives, for their congregational region, who voted them into office. That way reformist minded Joshua like members can better focus their efforts at organizing members to remove those elected representatives.
At present I’m unable to find records of how elected conference, union, and division officers voted. Or even who is my member representative and which other congregations they serve in my area. For a democratic system, that is troubling. So do these records already exist on the Internet? If not, are there any efforts being made to organize such a website? If not, where do I find those records?