Very recently we received this video produced by Michael McCaffrey. McCaffrey examines closely important parallels between the rebellion of Korah and the present attempt to introduce women’s ordination. You might think “I’ve read this before,” but this is a very powerful presentation not only on this point, but also in terms of God’s design. Is there a profound parallel between these two “movements,” and more, what is the significance of Aaron’s Rod that budded?
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50 replies on “Women's ordination and the rebellion of Korah”
What more evidence do we need? How much clearer can it get? An excellent presentation. Thank you.
Dear Michael, thank you very much for this clear and courageous presentation of truth in the
last minute, before the question of woman ordination will be decided in San Antonio.
May God bless you, all the members of CAP and all true believers, and may He strengthen
us in the future, to take a bold stand to truth, as soldiers of Christ.
May He humble our hearts, that we have the spirit of our redeemer and not of Satan, who
wanted to be like God.
Praise God for working through you to make this excellent presentation.
Why does the Adventist Church make women’s ordination such an issue? Ellen White was an ordained minister. Those who oppose will just not recognize this. What a deception on the part of the church. The Church can’t have it both ways. If the Church accepts EGW’s ordination, it has to accept Women’s Ordination, period. If God called Ellen, He must call other women to be ordained. Why should the world take this religion seriously when it so profoundly inconsistent? Amazing. Carol C.
Carol, it would be good to start with the facts. Ellen G. White was NOT an ordained minister–not in the sense that the church is talking about. She never served as an elder, and thus was never pastor over a church congregation. Your initial premise is simply false. She was, of course, as are all prophets, appointed or ordained by God as prophet. The church never ordained anyone as prophet. She did serve the church. This is not what the church is addressing. The issue to be decided by the Seventh-day Adventist Church is, shall the church ordain women to serve as primary congregational leaders, i.e., as elders and senior pastors and hold position in the authoritative ecclesiastical office over men–something the Bible explicitly prohibits.
What are we going to do about our previous decisions and actions to ordain female elders and to commission female pastors? We have an untenable position here unless we are willing to establish Biblical consistency by rescinding those decisions.
I have learned that taking a step backwards allows one to go forward.
Carol,
It is the position of the Ellen White estate that she was not ordained. Do you know something they don’t?
Carol, you have been mis-informed about Ellen White. She was not ordained.
Why do we need Ellen White to have been ordained to be certain that other women can be ordained? No, she was not ordained my humans. She was given ordination credentials but was not literally ordained. It is amazing how we forget that ordination is only the church’s method of recognizing one’s call to ministry. How dear we say or judge that a woman did not get that call! Women’s brains are just as good a men’s only. Women built the first motherboard for computers. That’s great mathematical, reasoning brains. Male and female genital organs are complementary and not opposite. They need each other equally. Women can stand more heat than men. They live longer. They have larger stomach and kidneys. So what is the problem here? Women are to be ordained because they were made with equal authority before sin and Jesus came to restore that authority.
Ordination was not something made up by the church, it is a biblical doctrine.
Because God’s law’s eternal and we broke this law, He set up the temple sacrificial system and it’s purposes for our salvation as a type of what’s in heaven.
All explained how detestable sin is to God but because of His love for us, He had provided a Saviour to die for us, ie. all pointed to Jesus Christ, the lamb without blemish Who reconciles us to God.
The system and law were intertwined. In God’s system no women priest/s officiated in heaven/earth, such is only found in pagan religions instigated by Satan the adversary, to remove the image, principles and salvation of God from all mankind.
God does not change and all His acts are righteous. We humans are not God. If we believe in God we should accept His authority.
I am so glad someone has mentioned the sacrificial system as the foundation of the priesthood, thus the premise for the disqualification of women to be ordained. What NO ONE seems to remember is that the sacrificial system and ALL ITS ordinances were nailed to the cross according to Paul (Eph.& Col.) The topic of WO should not even be on the table because according to Paul, in Christ, there is no difference. If anyone is going against biblical teachings, it is all those who oppose it. The teaching of “Headship Theology” was created back in the 1970s in response to the rising feminist movement, not by Adventists but by Calvinists. Those in opposition are the ones guilty of conforming to the world, not those in favor. I pray that the scales be removed from the eyes of those who sincerely want to know and follow truth, and that the stubborn “Balaams” of this generation will have an unforgettable encounter with the God of Truth. However, we must recall that E. White predicted that on one in twenty Adventists will be saved. That means the majority will not be following God’s Truth. Which group do you want to be a part of? The majority, or God’s minority? Men, as well as women, must become submissive to the will of God.
We’ll all be equal in Heaven, right? Obviously not here on earth cuz of the curse of sin, but eventually, right?
This is what Jesus came to restore:
“Under God, Adam was to stand at the head of the earthly family to maintain the principles of the heavenly family. This would have brought peace and happiness. But the law that none “liveth to himself” Satan was determined to oppose. He desired to live for self. He sought to make himself a center of influence. It was this that incited rebellion in heaven, and it was man’s acceptance of this principle that brought sin on earth. When Adam sinned, man broke away from the heaven-ordained center…. Through Christ, God works to bring man back to his first relation to his Creator and to correct the disorganizing influences brought in by Satan.” 6T 236, 237
This is the first GC session I’ve actually paid attention to. I don’t know why it’s such a big deal either sometimes. God is going to use who He’s going to use, to do what He wants to accomplish. Period. We’re not going to stand in the way of God. Ever.
I agree with you Carol. It is absolutely ridiculous that our own Church Prophet is a Woman and the Leaders are supposed to be going by her guidance. And then they turn around and claim that Women don’t have what it takes to be a Minister.
And it is even more ridiculous since Ellen White’s own Secretary, Clarence Crisler said that just because she did not openly support Women’s Ordination doesn’t mean that Women will not be ordained in the future or that they are unfit for the role of Minister. The stupidity on this is just amazing to me. I can only shake my head in dismay.
My goodness if this is not the best presentation that I have ever seen. I don’t know how the Bretheren is going to get around this presentation, of “TRUTH” and the Reality of the “TRUTH”
Mr. Mccaffrey, “YES” I believe “GOD” gave you this one.
In this presentation you have methodically, with patience brought us to what this church is truly up against.
Oh how I wish that I could get this presentation before the brethren, and the Delegates. I’ve committed to sharing it as far as I can take it. Thanks, Micheal Mccaffrey, on a presentation “Well Done”. “GOD” Bless you….
I know a lot of people in my church are of this position. There are a few who aren’t. What will the vote on WO change?
Praise God for working through you to create this presentation. I was compelled to share with friends and trust they will also be blessed.
It seems the best wine was saved for the last! Super presentation!
One more parallel we see is that the world was plunged into sin and death in the beginning by Eve seeking a position not assigned to her. Now at the end of the controversy the test is repeated, and ‘Eve’ is being tempted again to partake of the the same fruit by seeking a position not assigned to her. And ‘Adam’, where are you this time as Eve wanders off? This time find Eve quickly and remind yourselves of the Word of God! We need to pass this last big test in preparation for the latter rain of the Holy Spirit to reach a dying world with the gospel.
The last big test is still the Sabbath issue and God’s law vs. Man’s law, right? WO isn’t a test, is it?
I am sure that this man is honest in his beliefs, but I can not understand his original premise. How does the rebellion of Korah have anything to do with spiritual gifts given by God? This man takes his original premise and puts women and their only roll in life as child baring. Today the priesthood is “of all believers” There is no priest between God and his people.
Is there a particular Ellen G. White quotation he is sharing that you are disagreeing with or that you feel he has taken out of context? Could you point to a very specific problem rather than a vague one? Thanks.
Valerie, Michael’s film is excellent and an insight from God. I will share it with others.
From personal experience, I believe that if we sincerely seek and ask God for answers He always provides it.
I know of another person (an SDA who wishes not to be named) who has been perturbed about WO and has been asking God about it through prayer. Amazingly the same finding as Michael’s was shown to them, even though they were completely unaware of Michael’s short film. They haven’t watched the film, so they do not know of it’s content. The EG White’s quote in Patriachs an Prophets completely tied in with the insight given, amazing.
I’m very grateful to our God, He works in mysterious ways His Wonders to perform, hallelujah!
Valerie, it appears that you don’t understand this video because you don’t understand the basic premise of God’s governmental hierarchy. He is not a God of confusion, but One of order. You also don’t understand the difference between spiritual gifts bestowed by the Holy Spirit versus leadership ROLES in the Church. The latter are roles that are filled by men. Unfortunately, these filled positions/roles can oftentimes be filled by men that shouldn’t have the position, but that is up to us as members to make leaders aware when a role holder is clearly not fulfilling his obligation according to the requsites mandated in Scripture. God created man in His image; whereby they had the built-in model of the Godhead of submissivness. Woman is submissive to man, man to Christ, and Christ to God. The hype of ‘preisthood of believers’ belongs to the devil. This line isn’t even in the Bible – not in this way. It is taken out of context by the devil. This was his line when he rebelled in Heaven and it is the very line that Korah used as well. Anyone with selfish motives (and that is our fallen nature) will grab a line such as this & run with it. In so doing, they ignore all the plain Biblical texts that demonstrate this line isn’t being applied correctly. This WO movement is clearly a rebellion exactly like Korah’s and Miriam. God punished Miriam with leprosy, and He will punish those in rebellion against His hierarchal design of leadership in His Church. His punishment will come in His time and manner. This rebellion must first reach its full maturity before He does though, so that all will clearly see the complete wickedness festering behind the scenes of this controversy.
Thank-you Doris. You have a clear understanding of Bible truth and the principles behind them on this issue, and I imagine that is the same for other Bible truths as well. God is orderly in what He does. He’s always right, all the time. It’s Satan that takes truth and injects error into it and then pawns that truth-error combination off to us humans as truth supposedly coming from our faithful God in Heaven. The sad thing is that we all to often take this truth-error mixture as OK truth and leave the pure truth from God alone. We’re so used to this truth-error mixture that we have a hard time getting our minds around the fact that we don’t have to do this. We can REJECT ERROR ALL THE TIME and ACCEPT AND KEEP TRUTH ALWAYS. If we can do something once, we can continue to do it. This is all doable, and it has to be done “in the strength of the Mighty One” or else it becomes failure without the helping strength of Christ. Philippians 4:13 is clear. “I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me. Those who finish this work during the time of the Loud Cry just ahead of us will be “only those who have withstood temptation in the strength of the Mighty One”. They alone “will be permitted to act a part in proclaiming it when it shall have swelled into the loud cry.” Review and Herald, November 19, 1908 par. 9
1Ti 3:14 These things write I unto thee, hoping to come unto thee shortly:
1Ti 3:15 But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.
1Ti 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
Tit 1:5 For this cause left I thee in Crete, that thou shouldest set in order the things that are wanting, and ordain elders in every city, as I had appointed thee:
Tit 1:6 If any be blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children not accused of riot or unruly.
Tit 1:7 For a bishop must be blameless, as the steward of God; not selfwilled, not soon angry, not given to wine, no striker, not given to filthy lucre;
1Ti 3:12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
The Key ideas are “how to behave in the house of God” and “set in order”. In the church order and proper behavior is Leaders who are good husbands and fathers in their homes. How do women do this unless we upend the order of Genesis and get rid of “male ” “rule over thee…” and say both men and women can rule in the home. We can only have female leadership when society has gotten rid of the rule of the man in the home.
Michael, is it possible to get your speech as pdf-file or PowerPoint file?
So the studying would be easier.
Thank you for sharing. It is a probably the best presentation I have seen or hear on the subject. I just pray that enough of the delegate who have been in favor of Women’s Ordination will have seen this with an honest and open heart and will vote accordingly. God is speaking to us through this presentation.
Dear Lord God, let not the delegates of your remnant church behave today concerning the topic of ordination of women as elders and pastors as the Justices of the SCOTUS has done regarding homosexual marriage. Guide this church to continue obeying Your Word. Thank you, God. Amen.
The presentation begins on the premise that the priesthood of OT is still present today. In DA it clearly states that in Jesus we had passed from one economy to another. Type met anti type and now it is as is clear in NT that we are the priesthood of all believers with Jesus as the head. What if the rebellion is from those seeking to deplete the workers and therefore delay Christ s coming?
Isn’t bible truth wonderful? It doesn’t need any convoluted explanations or long drawn out arguments, just the Holy Spirit and a humble teachable heart to understand and to accept scripture as it reads. Of this precious book, Paul wrote:
2 Timothy 3:16 King James Version (KJV)
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
While in the SOP we find the following:
I take the Bible just as it is, as the Inspired Word. I believe its utterances in an entire Bible.—Selected Messages, book 1, p. 17.
Brethren, cling to your Bible, as it reads, and stop your criticisms in regard to its validity, and obey the Word, and not one of you will be lost.—Ibid., p. 18.
Brother and Sisters the bible consistently presents males as both the priest of the home and also the priest in God’s church, no amount of scriptural gymnastics or interpretation based on culture will ever change a clear thus sayeth the Lord.
Thank you dear Bro. McCaffrey, for allowing the Holy Spirit to use you in putting together this scripturally and SOP based presentation.
I do however feel that inspite of all your wonderful efforts and that of the contributions made on this informative web site, the vote on women’s ordination at the GC will be passed because the real issue is to introduce the acceptance of practising LBGT individuals, as the hermeneutics used to validate WO opens wide the door to gay and lesbian membership.
Has anyone else noticed the ‘rainbow’ coloured parasols and ‘butterfly’ on the GC brochure along with the brightly coloured sets?
Dana, we’ve noticed it in our home and some of us have studied ‘visual literacy/semiotics (semiology)’.
It was the first thing that stood out.
Whoever designed this stage and picked those colours knew what they were doing.
In which way did the colours reflect the ethos of the SDA church or the theme of the GC session?
Nothing new. These symbols are all over our work. The last general conference stage set of five years ago was a symbol of the eye, behind the pulpit, It raised eyebrows. Check it. Whilst symbols matter, God is greater. We cannot be chasing these things. We have a war at the heart of this work. Let us pray for faithfulness on our part to the message. The message is everything. Let us fovus on the message: getting it out. This mischief will always be sneaked in, God will take care of it as he did of Judas,
This Church will never be Babylon. The devil can try but it will never be a part of his act. God will clean it up and bring it through. I thank the delegates for a resounding NO vote. He can steal our money and corrupt our institutions and destroy our mission work and missionary spirit but the Seventh Day Adventist church will never be a part of the devil’s kingdom. There will be Babylonians in it but the movement itself will never be Babylon. Stay put and stay true. God will clean and clear things up Himself.
I see both sides, but I’m still praying about this. I’ve refrained from intaking opinions, but I watched Pastor Bachelor, read something from Lightbearers, and I’m being told I HAVE to take a position from this video. Why? I thought we weren’t supposed to divide on anything other than the Sabbath issue. People are talking about painful rifts, and I’m like, “What?” Oh no, this convert will not have it. I love my church family too much let this issue distract.
I totally get that as women our desire shall be for our husbands and he shall rule over us. Yes, that’s part of the curse. It’s pretty evident that part of the curse is still in effect. But for how long?
If we can’t accept the idea of gender equality here, then how will we accept it in Heaven? I think the issue behind this probably originated with someone wanting to get paid for doing what she loves.
Whatever happens at GC will not affect one thing in my life, because I’m not going to college for anything ever again and have no desire to be an ordained ANYTHING. Titles are for the world. Jesus is coming back sooner than people realize.
Thank you for taking the time to make this video, but I didn’t like the music in the background adding dramatic effect and trying to influence me. It was subtle but I know recognize the tactic. I also realize now that politics in the world AND in the church should never take up as much time as this issue has taken to search out. I’m trying to raise kids and I obviously need to take that more seriously and focus my attention exactly where the Lord has it—on kids. Isn’t there a prophecy about the hearts of the FATHERS turning BACK to the children? Can we vote on that next?
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I have some questions. Why would it be rebellion for God’s people to go back to God’s two original institutions, which have not been changed by God? We uphold the second institution which was given to humans, as unchanging – the 7th day Sabbath – and right we should do just that. Why is it rebellion to uphold the first institution that God gave to humans – male and female ‘as one’ having dominion over the earth? Yes, a change happened but it wasn’t from God and Jesus even said He hadn’t changed God’s original plan for marriage and family governance (Matthew 19 and Mark 10). Yes, a change happened when Adam and Eve chose another master than their loving Father. Yes, God told them the consequences of that choice. No, God’s original plan for governance has never changed. Yes, when Israel, at Sinai, instead of accepting God’s words when He said ‘I have already delivered you – from Egypt (symbol of Satan’s governance) and from slavery (Satan’s form of dominance such as master/slave, hierarchy, and over/under mentality) – Israel instead counter offered by telling God ‘all you have said we will do and be obedient’. God had given them anew His original covenant of ‘grace’. Instead they offered God their alternative (now called old covenant of ‘do and live’, or ‘obey and live’). God did not want that but because He will not force, He gave them ‘rules and laws’ and more and they well proved that they couldn’t do it. Are you saying that we are to back to the old covenant of ‘do and live’? Yes, in that system there was a lot of male hierachy. But it was not God’s original plan. Which is really rebellion? Is it accepting God’s offer at Mt. Sinai when He said to them and says to us even today, “I am the Lord your God which have brought you out (I have already delivered you)? Accepting God’s everlasting covenant
is righteousness by faith. Praise God. Wouldn’t any other response really be ‘rebellion’?
People are digging deep down below the surface and coming up with all sorts of things like this one and it sounds good but it is not good.
Barrington, don’t be vague, please can you explain why it is not good.
It has become increasingly clear that in nearly every endeavor that men can achieve success women also can be successful. There also is an extremely powerful tendency for men to treat women as an under class that should not be allowed to do many things that traditionally only men do. Example after example of women taking on and achieving goals in the traditional male realm can be cited. In most cases there has been strong push back from the men in power. To say that E. G. White was not ordained is a mere technicality when it comes to her ministry and leadership with the church. If the SDA church continues to refuse to ordain women logically they must dismiss and retract their entire reliance on her role in the church and renounce her “ministry” as a hoax because of course she is a woman and thereby completely unqualified for the role she Kaye’s in church teachings. It is absolutely irrational not to come to a similar conclusion on this matter.
Hello Olive and Ed, it would be good to learn first the ABC of Ordination. Please read the Position 1 of TOSC and for example the articles of Clinton Wahlen and Gerard P. Damsteegt. Than you have a good foundation to discuss this issue. The Level of discussion is now 100 and you start with 1 again.
I have to say I have in my own mind had already felt the womens ordination issue is the same as the Korah incident. This has been on my mind a lot and so glad to find others who think the same. I have not yet had the chance to view the video and hope to soon. To me it is clearly of the same spirit of rebellion as I feel God appointed this role to men only. And that it has not changed. Just as God specifically appointed the priesthood in that time to aaron and the leadership to moses. The corellation and repeat of history is uncanny and if one reads the account in the bible and the spirit of prophecy it is the very same argument. Just with a different flavor. Satan tried the same thing over and over just with different people and in a different way
If only we would cling to the Lord’s guidance then we would not have this problem of women ordination. We truly are the church of Laodicea because we think that “we need nothing” and we rely on our own thinking and interpretation. We need to stop focusing on who’s right or who’s wrong but rather humble ourselves like the apostles in the Pentecost and the Lord will guide us through the Holy Spirit.
In a way, I think we might be like James and John debating on which side of the throne they will sit. We need to set aside our differences and like the presentation of Mike, we need to ask the Lord as Moses did in the past rather than look at the interpretation of the Bible of different “respectable” people.
Nice try, but this story was for men still, bible says it clear that Men, not women.
They rebel against another issue, but not of a women.
God gave it to Men, old and new Test, mention it.. MEN.
what can a women say that a men cant preach?
so why do we need women like Catholics? Next its Gay marrying in the church. Lets all follow catholic and worship on Sunday too….
Then GOD said,”let us make man in our own image, after our likeness”… Gen1:26. So GOD created man in our own image,in the image of GOD he created him… Gen1:27. God is omniscince i.e all knowing. He knew that time like this will com, that was why He took time to explain the verses above. Maranatha!!!
Very good presentation Thank you
Last I knew, God was the judge of the Rebellion of Korah and remains the judge today.
I have some serious questions for you: What should a woman do if she feels in her heart that God is calling her for ministry? What if she has asked for confirmation from God and time after time He confirms the call? What if many people around this woman say that she should be a pastor, that she evidently has a call from God to minister?
Ask Miriam what happened when she too wanted to be a pastoress.
With the majority not supporting womens’ ordination only Jesuits favor splitting the church.
How long now since women has been exempt from the priest hood? From Melchisedec to 1972 when Josephine Benton was ordained for the first time as elder in the SDA Church.
Hence those who oppose women has headship are companion of moses and the prophets even to jesus and the apostles, from reformers to protestants to Sda upto 1971. To the ladies and the men who supports them please obey God word below.
Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they(some women and men) said, We will not walk therein. Jeremiah 6:16
This is not a Korah prophesy issue, but rather a way to appease the more patriarchal societies the SDA church has established itself. If the Worldwide general conference ruled to allow women ordination it might cause a major split with a significant # of these patriarchal culture churches. Is it worth that ? At this time the risk of the gender neutral cultural churches splitting off is far less if we keep things as they are. There is also the IRS/501c3 church tax exemption in play here in the USA. Ordaining women at this point could have some costly tax consequences the Gen’l Conf finds detrimental to the organization’s financial health. So while this video comes in and tries to support the status quo of denial of women ordination, the Gen’l Conf. can hardly embrace it as it has publicly insisted that this is not a biblical-doctrinal issue BUT purely an administrative issue. I would be very inconsistent if they did an about-face now.
My view is the Korah incident is a historic type of prophecy that can be applied to the insidious doctrine of Intercessory Prayer, that has swept through just about every religion on earth. Sinful humans lifting up other sinful humans to G-d in effect obscures and replaces the Christ DAILY work of INTERCEDING on the sinners behalf as they offer their sacrifices of prayer confessions and repentance to YHWH in our Savior’s name (Yahushua). There is One mediator, One intercessor, One advocate the sinner has with the our heavenly Father and that One person is Yahushua ha Mashiach. While I implore people to pray, i cannot pray for them, this sacrifice they must take to the heavenly Sanctuary of their own freewill. Today all the worlds religions have some doctrine of human intercession, this is an offense to YHWH and Yahushua who went through the torture of the cross to establish himself as humankinds ONLY trustworthy priest/intercessor. Like KORAH, all who buy into this doctrine are in open rebellion to the intercessor YHWH has ordained, being His Son. SDA’s with their knowledge of Daniel 8 & 9, the DAILY, and the heavenly Sanctuary should be able to see this fallacy for what it is and if not have rejected their mission YHWH has assigned them.
So Moses is not a type of SDA priesthood and Korah is not a type of SDA’s pushing for women ordination. Moses is a type of the Messiah and Korah is a type of humankind that “feels” compelled to usurp Messiah’s ordained role as our ONE and ONLY intercessor.